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mx2
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Joined: 18 Jan 2006
Posts: 1968
Location: Miami, Florida
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 Posted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 2:28 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | What I would like to remove is this continued implication that form follows function some how limits creativity or variety or means in itself that we can not have buildings like the Sydney Opera House. |
The likes of the Sydney Opera House, or just about anything designed by the likes of Saarineen, Gehry, Safdie, or Libeskind, are not mired in Form Following Function, although they all meet basic functions...and more! Function would indeed limit designers from pushing the envelopes...that's what the criticism was about the Sydney Opera House...many purists hated it!!!
The implication is that good design does not rely any single given idea, especially FFF. Good design is based on taking into consideration all things appropriate to the project, including FFF (either one).
mx2.5
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*Art of Architecture: The conscious use of skill and creative imagination in the production of an aesthetic building.
*Science of Architecture: The calculated use of technical skill and knowledge in the construction of a functional building. |
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csintexas
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Joined: 06 Feb 2006
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| Posted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 3:09 pm Post subject: |
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First.
I never made the statement that every building designer on Earth must always (with absolutely no exception) make every design decision based on functional performance.
Do you recall me saying that?
Second.
Your argument hinges on the notion that the Sydney Opera house or Walt Disney Concert Hall represent the absolute pinnacle of perfection and can never be exceeded.
I don't buy it.
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Chris Stewart
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mx2
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Joined: 18 Jan 2006
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| Posted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 7:44 pm Post subject: |
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Now you are being completely disingenuous...good design is good. Name one project that is perfect! By who's standards?
I can only chuckle as you attempt to stray yet once again by angling off-subject digs...you are a Master at that.
You've spent a year as a staunch proponent of Form Must Follow Function and fought tooth and nail against any person or idea that contradicted that notion. But I digress...I admit: you never said...
...your very first response:
| Quote: | | Personally I think form follows function is an interesting concept that may not have been explored to it's full potential. First we have to fully understand the function and this is a difficult thing to do. |
...then later on down the road:
| Quote: | | Yes you can assign a function to any form. I can design a cube then mount it on a wagon axle and call it a wheel. Would I be an artist or an idiot? |
...then sometime later, a real zinger:
| Quote: | | The modernist where never about function as much as style |
...but this one comes pretty close to preaching:
| Quote: | | The only obligation we have to the greater good is the one you don't seem to think much of -function. |
...but the one statement you kept repeating time and time again in your argument was the quintessential place of departure for you:
| Quote: | | This is what form follows function means whether you agree with it or not |
As if to say, we have no say but to accept it. No, you never did quite say it Chris...that you did not. I concur.
mx2.5
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csintexas
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Joined: 06 Feb 2006
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| Posted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 8:14 pm Post subject: |
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I really have trouble understanding you sometimes.
Do you have some point in all that or are you just thinking aloud?
| Quote: | | You've spent a year as a staunch proponent of Form Must Follow Function and fought tooth and nail against any person or idea that contradicted that notion |
yes, I have always defended it as a good general concept which is most appropriate to architecture but that is completely different from saying there is no room for anything else.
| Quote: | | Now you are being completely disingenuous...good design is good. Name one project that is perfect! By who's standards? |
You are the only one who keeps pulling up examples of buildings as some sort of proof another method produces as good or better architecture.
The only way they can be proof is if there is no way any building could be better. This is simple logical deduction.
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Chris Stewart
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csintexas
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| Posted: Wed Jul 02, 2008 7:30 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Well said, all of you. Interesting subject when I really think about it more carefully. It grasps at the very substance of humanity...at large. Which is where I would argue lies the root of ethics of architecture; we are servants towards humanity, not just humans. In fact, nowadays we are proponents of far greater than just that; ie sustainability. |
| Quote: |
The only obligation we have to the greater good is the one you don't seem to think much of -function. |
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csintexas
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| Posted: Wed Jul 02, 2008 7:48 am Post subject: |
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Form following function?
Whatever else it may be it is impressive
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Chris Stewart
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mx2
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Joined: 18 Jan 2006
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| Posted: Wed Jul 02, 2008 3:06 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | The only way they can be proof is if there is no way any building could be better. This is simple logical deduction. |
OMG!!! Do you do it on purpose? There is no template to follow...no bible, no set rules or laws (less the minimums) on how to design a PERFECT buildng. I was trying to bring you down from your plateau of Form Follows Function and yes I had a point in showing you your own position on this issue. You're quotes CLEARLY demonstrate how adamant you are about this silly little quote! Less is more is just as critical...it's a preference to priorities from unlimited design choices!!!!!!
Now here's question for you buddy...what's your point?
mx2.5
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*Science of Architecture: The calculated use of technical skill and knowledge in the construction of a functional building. |
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djswan
Joined: 17 Aug 2007
Posts: 849
Location: Montana, USA
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| Posted: Wed Jul 02, 2008 3:16 pm Post subject: |
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if function followed form then all forms would be perfect.
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csintexas
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| Posted: Wed Jul 02, 2008 4:28 pm Post subject: |
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My point?
My point is that if we are in a thread discussing FFF than we should discuss it.
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Chris Stewart
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csintexas
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| Posted: Wed Jul 02, 2008 4:30 pm Post subject: |
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| csintexas wrote: | | Quote: | | Well said, all of you. Interesting subject when I really think about it more carefully. It grasps at the very substance of humanity...at large. Which is where I would argue lies the root of ethics of architecture; we are servants towards humanity, not just humans. In fact, nowadays we are proponents of far greater than just that; ie sustainability. |
| Quote: |
The only obligation we have to the greater good is the one you don't seem to think much of -function. |
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Did you not see the irony in this mx2.5?
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Chris Stewart
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mx2
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Joined: 18 Jan 2006
Posts: 1968
Location: Miami, Florida
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| Posted: Wed Jul 02, 2008 9:37 pm Post subject: |
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dude...put down the crack pipe and stop jumping around from one topic to another. what's the point? Why would you put my response to a question about ETHICS in architecture with your comment about FUNCTION...and then somehow think that you made a point by asking me if it's ironic
NO...it's not ironic...it doesn't make sense at all. Well, I'm sure it makes perfect sense to you. I'm not sure I want to continue with this conversation...going nowhere, fast!
mx2.5
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*Art of Architecture: The conscious use of skill and creative imagination in the production of an aesthetic building.
*Science of Architecture: The calculated use of technical skill and knowledge in the construction of a functional building. |
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csintexas
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| Posted: Thu Jul 03, 2008 6:35 am Post subject: |
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Wow you are slow on the uptake.
I would argue lies the root of ethics of architecture; we are servants towards humanity, not just humans. In fact, nowadays we are proponents of far greater than just that; ie sustainability.
You make the point that we are servants to humanity and probably have an obligation toward sustainability.
Sustainability is function
You can't easily design a sustainable building without making function your highest priority. (unless it is just dumb luck)
The irony is that you criticize me for saying we have an obligation to the greater good to make architecture sustainable and then make the exact same statement.
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Chris Stewart
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solidred
Joined: 05 Jan 2006
Posts: 628
Location: Scotland
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| Posted: Thu Jul 03, 2008 9:45 am Post subject: |
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This is like watching Wimbledon on the TV.
'advantage CS' there, I guess.
But i anticipate a feisty serve next from mx2  
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mx2
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Joined: 18 Jan 2006
Posts: 1968
Location: Miami, Florida
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| Posted: Thu Jul 03, 2008 12:37 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks solidred for fanning the flame! Ha!
Sustainability is not function. Sustainability is a function! Function is not a sustainability. No irony here...just more smoke and mirrors and strawmen.
Function is never the only priority, not even when you think it is. If it were, you would be an engineer designing boxes!
Round and round and round we go...I'm gonna have to put this on auto-pilot soon! 
mx2.5
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*Art of Architecture: The conscious use of skill and creative imagination in the production of an aesthetic building.
*Science of Architecture: The calculated use of technical skill and knowledge in the construction of a functional building. |
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csintexas
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Joined: 06 Feb 2006
Posts: 1919
Location: USA
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| Posted: Thu Jul 03, 2008 1:58 pm Post subject: |
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Sustainability is not function.
Sustainability is a function!
Make up your mind.
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Chris Stewart
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