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Richard Haut
millennium club
Joined: 18 Apr 2004
Posts: 1165
Location: Nice, France
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 Posted: Thu Aug 10, 2006 12:30 pm Post subject: "Stupidity or Machiavellianism?" |
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Solidred has it right - Stupidity or Machiavellianism?
| Quote: | | the purpose of terrorism is to cause terror |
- Vladimir Ilyich Ivanov (better known as "Lenin")
the following is an article (since withdrawn from their website under a UK Government "D-Notice") published by the Guardian on part of the story of a fabricated terror plot. With British airports shut over 'terror-plot-foiled' stories, what is anyone to believe - is there a risk, and if so, from whom - does the violence used against Afghanistan, Iraq, the Palestinians and the Lebanese contribute to or cause such risks ?
| Quote: | Fake Terror - Ricin
Ring That Never Was
Yesterday's trial collapse has exposed the deception behind
attempts to link al-Qaida to a 'poison attack' on London
By Duncan Campbell
The Guardian - UK
4-15-5
Colin Powell does not need more humiliation over the manifold errors in his February 2003 presentation to the UN. But yesterday a London jury brought down another section of the case he made for war - that Iraq and Osama bin Laden were supporting and directing terrorist poison cells throughout Europe, including a London ricin ring.
Yesterday's verdicts on five defendants and the dropping of charges against four others make clear there was no ricin ring. Nor did the "ricin ring" make or have ricin. Not that the government shared that news with us. Until today, the public record for the past three fear-inducing years has been that ricin was found in the Wood Green flat occupied by some of yesterday's acquitted defendants. It wasn't.
The third plank of the al-Qaida-Iraq poison theory was the link between what Powell labelled the "UK poison cell" and training camps in Afghanistan. The evidence the government wanted to use to connect the defendants to Afghanistan and al-Qaida was never put to the jury. That was because last autumn a trial within a trial was secretly taking place. This was a private contest between a group of scientists from the Porton Down military research centre and myself. The issue was: where had the information on poisons and chemicals come from?
The information - five pages in Arabic, containing amateur instructions for making ricin, cyanide and botulinum, and a list of chemicals used in explosives - was at the heart of the case. The notes had been made by Kamel Bourgass, the sole convicted defendant. His co-defendants believed that he had copied the information from the internet. The prosecution claimed it had come from Afghanistan.
I was asked to look for the original source on the internet. This meant exploring Islamist websites that publish Bin Laden and his sympathisers, and plumbing the most prolific source of information on how to do harm: the writings of the American survivalist right and the gun lobby.
The experience of being an expert witness on these issues has made me feel a great deal safer on the streets of London. These were the internal documents of the supposed al-Qaida cell planning the "big one" in Britain. But the recipes were untested and unoriginal, borrowed from US sources. Moreover, ricin is not a weapon of mass destruction. It is a poison which has only ever been used for one-on-one killings and attempted killings.
If this was the measure of the destructive wrath that Bin Laden's followers were about to wreak on London, it was impotent. Yet it was the discovery of a copy of Bourgass's notes in Thetford in 2002 that inspired the wave of horror stories and government announcements and preparations for poison gas attacks.
It is true that when the team from Porton Down entered the Wood Green flat in January 2003, their field equipment registered the presence of ricin. But these were high sensitivity field detectors, for use where a false negative result could be fatal. A few days later in the lab, Dr Martin Pearce, head of the Biological Weapons Identification Group, found that there was no ricin. But when this result was passed to London, the message reportedly said the opposite.
The planned government case on links to Afghanistan was based only on papers that a freelance journalist working for the Times had scooped up after the US invasion of Kabul. Some were in Arabic, some in Russian. They were far more detailed than Bourgass's notes. Nevertheless, claimed Porton Down chemistry chief Dr Chris Timperley, they showed a "common origin and progression" in the methods, thus linking the London group of north Africans to Afghanistan and Bin Laden.
The weakness of Timperley's case was that neither he nor the intelligence services had examined any other documents that could have been the source. We were told Porton Down and its intelligence advisers had never previously heard of the "Mujahideen Poisons Handbook, containing recipes for ricin and much more". The document, written by veterans of the 1980s Afghan war, has been on the net since 1998.
All the information roads led west, not to Kabul but to California and the US midwest. The recipes for ricin now seen on the internet were invented 20 years ago by survivalist Kurt Saxon. He advertises videos and books on the internet. Before the ricin ring trial started, I phoned him in Arizona. For $110, he sent me a fistful of CDs and videos on how to make bombs, missiles, booby traps - and ricin. We handed a copy of the ricin video to the police.
When, in October, I showed that the chemical lists found in London were an exact copy of pages on an internet site in Palo Alto, California, the prosecution gave up on the Kabul and al-Qaida link claims. But it seems this information was not shared with the then home secretary, David Blunkett, who was still whipping up fear two weeks later. "Al-Qaida and the international network is seen to be, and will be demonstrated through the courts over months to come, actually on our doorstep and threatening our lives," he said on November 14.
The most ironic twist was an attempt to introduce an "al-Qaida manual" into the case. The manual - called the Manual of the Afghan Jihad - had been found on a raid in Manchester in 2000. It was given to the FBI to produce in the 2001 New York trial for the first attack on the World Trade Centre. But it wasn't an al-Qaida manual. The name was invented by the US department of justice in 2001, and the contents were rushed on to the net to aid a presentation to the Senate by the then attorney general, John Ashcroft, supporting the US Patriot Act.
To show that the Jihad manual was written in the 1980s and the period of the US-supported war against the Soviet occupation was easy. The ricin recipe it contained was a direct translation from a 1988 US book called the Poisoner's Handbook, by Maxwell Hutchkinson.
We have all been victims of this mass deception. I do not doubt that Bourgass would have contemplated causing harm if he was competent to do so. But he was an Islamist yobbo on his own, not an Al Qaida-trained superterrorist. An Asbo might be appropriate.
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Duncan Campbell is an investigative writer and a scientific expert witness on computers and telecommunications. He is author of War Plan UK and is not the Guardian journalist of the same name
© Guardian Newspapers Limited 2005 |
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Richard Haut has worked with the architectural profession for over 25 years and produces the weekly Richard Haut's Competitions, which has given architects details of many thousands of projects for which they can apply across Britain and Europe. |
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Ed Ziomek
Joined: 07 Jun 2005
Posts: 562
Location: Stamford, Connecticut
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| Posted: Thu Aug 17, 2006 8:26 am Post subject: Truth and Consequences? |
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Notes:
1. Bill Clinton made a great point two days ago, that the "war on terror" should be separated from the "War on Iraq".
I strongly agree, because I think the terror scares, many valid, many suspect, some contrived, are obviously being bundled into the "fear package" that gets people re-elected and rich at the same time. At the same time, the world is not safer from violence... the passion for violence increasing! Hundreds of billions of dollars are being spent which could be used for alternative energy research and Katrina rebuild efforts, or bolstering the economies of third world countries...we've discussed this already, I know.
2. Air America had a guest host on who made a remarkable observation that Osama BL is laying off America now that the US Air Force presence in Saudi Arabia has been removed...no more GIs in that country... an interesting comment. Who knows the truth?
3. Who won in all the terror-plot discoveries/revelations/retractions, and now the Lebanon debacle? The media portrays Hezbollah/Iran as winning this latest round, but I disagree.
The fear mongers have won, for sure, but what we have seen so far is only the "weakness bluffs", gee whiz Hezbollah - you are so big and bad- what can Israel and America possibly do to stop you (har-har). In the Machiavellian sense, does anybody doubt Lebanon is the "show and tell" pretext to the big show itself?
I fear, and what Rich had mentioned 8-10 months ago... Iran and to a lesser extent, Syria are the guaranteed targets.
This is where I differ in opinion, though, in this madness. Some personalities are so damaged by their own experience, there seems to be no peaceful solultion.
Ahmadinejag needs to be neutralized... diplomatically, or spiritually, or militarily... to me, he is a real terror threat to the world. Fight me now, fight me later, he is guaranteeing war, and devastating war he will get.
Our share of the madness?
The consequences of Americas dependence on oil, and pathetic 50 years of foreign policy in the world, where which should have made friends instead of enemies, are horrifying to me.
Prepare for much worse?
http://www.iranian.ws/cgi-bin/iran_news/exec/view.cgi/3/6695
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Richard Haut
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Joined: 18 Apr 2004
Posts: 1165
Location: Nice, France
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| Posted: Thu Aug 17, 2006 9:09 am Post subject: |
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Ed
Mahmoud Ahmadinejad is not the leader of Iran and he is zero threat to the West, unless Iran is attacked.
Hizbollah are not, and never have been "Iranian". They are totally Lebanese. And don't laugh at them too much - four full Divisions plus reserves with the latest armour and artillery, backed by a powerful airforce with total air superiority and backed by naval firepower were held off by less than two Brigades, poorly equipped with hand-held weapons and some WWII designed rockets.
I agree that Hizbollah did not "win", except in the sense of surviving as an intact fighting force and with their prestige through the roof, but Israel lost big time.
If, as many believe, the attacks on Lebanon were a way of firstly trying to neutralize Hizbollah (allied to Syria and Iran) and, secondly, to prepare the way for a US/Israeli attack on Syria and Iran, then Hizbollah may have saved your life and mine.
Israel appeared to have no defence against the Katyusha - a WWII rocket-propelled artillery shell. What would happen against recent missiles ? Well, we know that because Hizbollah appeared to have precisely one: a Silkworm, and it took out one of Israel's latest ships - a single shot.
Negotiate with Syria and Iran - they are not stupid. Also the greater the positive signs from the West, the lower Ahmadinejad's position in Iran.
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Richard Haut has worked with the architectural profession for over 25 years and produces the weekly Richard Haut's Competitions, which has given architects details of many thousands of projects for which they can apply across Britain and Europe. |
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Ed Ziomek
Joined: 07 Jun 2005
Posts: 562
Location: Stamford, Connecticut
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| Posted: Thu Aug 17, 2006 6:44 pm Post subject: Agree very much, and disagree... |
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Rich...well said, though I don't agree with all that you said.
Yes, Hezbollah survived, their prestige through the roof... but why crush the ants when you want the real Persian Lion?
Why not look weak fighting the ants, encourage the lion to play straight across?
And sure... lasers succeeded against Israel. Advanced Israeli tanks were destroyed, surprise, surprise. TOW missles maybe. 2000 mile missles are claimed now by Iran.
Which war was it, where Israel sent in drones to mimic Israeli fighters, and when the new radars were turned on... "Oh my goodness, thank you!"
Bang boom, sorry about that! Thanks for showing your hand.
Your quote...
"If, as many believe, the attacks on Lebanon were a way of firstly trying to neutralize Hizbollah (allied to Syria and Iran) and, secondly, to prepare the way for a US/Israeli attack on Syria and Iran, then Hizbollah may have saved your life and mine."
...puzzling last line, but you have been too right, too many times, too far before everyone else, so let me sit on that one...
The whole world lost, and will lose again, and again, and again. We never learn, and the big boys love their new toys.
I swear, a sexist, pansy-ass opinion of mine is that the world has lost its sexist balance... too much male testosterone, too little input from the mothers of the world...too few women's voices...its a male-cage match mentality nowadays, my rocket is bigger than your rocket!
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Richard Haut
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Location: Nice, France
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| Posted: Fri Aug 18, 2006 2:18 pm Post subject: |
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Ed
ask your self a question: why was Iraq attacked.
none of the reasons given - none of them - were either true, nor did they make sense. And the level of US casualties is simply tragic, and the Iraqi casualties ? probably uncounted. Feel safer ? Me neither.
now the self-same people are telling similar lies about Iran.
an extended war can, and probably would go nuclear. (You expect to survive ?)
you want peace ? Sack that sleazy racist shyster Bolton. Then tell Israel to get out of Palestinian land and to stay home. Never mind the rockets, Hizbollah had food - the IDF did not. There are very few acceptable reasons for an army, a well equipped army, leaving soldiers to go hungry in an action of a few days.
as for the big toy weaponry - how exactly was it that Israel, with all the talk about American anti-missile shields - seemed to be unable to stop any of one of the most basic forms of rocket available ?
the boys-with-their-toys (and these days girls as well) are largely involved with money. Mainly the US weapons corporations and, yes, the Carlyle Group among them - and the "contractors".
we all know about AIPAC and the way that Israel influences the US - what nobody weems to be asking is: why.
then remind yourself of the leering expression on the face of Bibi Netanyahu as he said "good !" when first being told about the attacks of 9.11.
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Richard Haut has worked with the architectural profession for over 25 years and produces the weekly Richard Haut's Competitions, which has given architects details of many thousands of projects for which they can apply across Britain and Europe. |
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Ed Ziomek
Joined: 07 Jun 2005
Posts: 562
Location: Stamford, Connecticut
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| Posted: Thu Aug 24, 2006 7:26 am Post subject: Post Mortem Comments |
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Two observations in the last 24 hours...
1. On the Imus radio/TV show, Thomas Friedman of the NY Times was mentioning that America should convene a study group ...not on what caused 9-11, but what has America done SINCE 9-11, and my interpretive paraphrase...is America gaining or losing on the world scene since 9-11?
I certainly agree and would hope that names like Abu Ghraib, Hidetha, the American sponsored "black sites" for sanctioned torture could be discussed, of the massive political, publicity, human damage points we inflicted on ourselves and the world.
Yes, there is questionable good news, like the trial of Saddam Hussein and his killing of "tens of thousands" of Kurdish tribal people, for which America's removal of Hussein caused 100,000 plus people to die mostly by horrific collateral damage. That Hussein article was on page 32 of the Daily News today, pre-empted by Tom Cruise on the cover, and too many other more important stories in between ("Bees nest in Hamptons", page 4).
2. An Arab American was on a CNN press conference...he has organized an Arab-American discussion group... and suggested that the only way to change this never-ending aggressiveness is not by military adventures by one side or the other, but by serious, honest negotiations. That includes the crippling actions and realizations that 25% of the elected Palestinian Parliament is in Israeli jails. How can you have peace or negotiations under this atmosphere, he basically asked?
On the honesty side, and mentioned by Rich earlier, the Gaza kidnappings by Israel pre-dated the Israel-soldier kidnappings by Hezbollah, not mentioning Lebanese kidnapped somewhere in between. This is the honesty that I can mention...
3. NY Post... Ralph Peters editorial, page 41 "Arabs Last Chance"...If Iraq's Democracy fails..."If Iraq's elected leaders won't stop looting their country long enough to pull together and defeat the foreign terrorists, internal insurgents and militias killing Iraqis, we should not ask our troops to defend them."
If I could add...the half-trillion dollars that Bush has spent to rebuild Iraq, is not necessarily getting TO Iraq. The Iraqi people don't have reliable drinking water, consistent electricity, or even consistent paychecks. Who among us doesn't believe that tens of billions of dollars have been looted along the way, not just by Iraqis?
And in 5 minutes, or 5 days, or 5 months, or 5 years, America will be asked to leave!
"Catastrophic Stupidity"!
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Ed Ziomek
Joined: 07 Jun 2005
Posts: 562
Location: Stamford, Connecticut
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| Posted: Thu Dec 07, 2006 5:44 pm Post subject: Original question...Stupidity or Machiavellianism? |
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The original wonderful question, so long ago (August?) was Stupidity or Machiavellianism?
With the avalanche of events and revelations and amazing responses of the last 48 hours...from the Iraq Study Group, to Gates' admission of "losing", to other incredible comments...
...let me add the obvious alternative to Stupidity and Machiavellianism... Mental Illness.
We are watching the disintegration of a Presidency via total denial and mis-placed blame on others, with a probable touch of medicated conditions...
I say it is time for Patriots to stand up, not the sorry reps we have in Washington who STILL suggest more troops, WHO STILL play the blame game, but the ordinary guys and gals and red-blooded Americans who know our America is in trouble, our troops are in harms way, and major significant changes are needed immediately.
KNOW THY ENEMY!
The enemy is pride and arrogance and mental illness and denial AND GREED, and selfishness, and lust for power.
Prime your literary muskets, fix your bayonet prose, man the ramparts!
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Richard Haut
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Joined: 18 Apr 2004
Posts: 1165
Location: Nice, France
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| Posted: Sat Dec 09, 2006 1:37 pm Post subject: |
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During the last day - New York, Virginia, Iowa, Louisiana, Texas, Delaware, Kentucky, Minnesota, Pennsylvania, Florida.
Each (and maybe other States) have lost one or more of their kids, husbands, fathers, loved ones, dead in Iraq. One day.
I don't know why. I doubt that their families and friends do either.
One day.
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Richard Haut has worked with the architectural profession for over 25 years and produces the weekly Richard Haut's Competitions, which has given architects details of many thousands of projects for which they can apply across Britain and Europe. |
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SDR
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Joined: 02 Oct 2004
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Location: San Francisco
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| Posted: Sat Dec 09, 2006 10:50 pm Post subject: |
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Pat Oliphant / Universal Press Syndicate 12/9/06[/img]
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"I'm the commander . . . see, I do not need to explain why I say things. That's the interesting thing about being the president. Maybe somebody needs to explain to me why they say something, but I don't feel like I owe anybody an explanation." GWB |
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Richard Haut
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Joined: 18 Apr 2004
Posts: 1165
Location: Nice, France
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| Posted: Sun Dec 10, 2006 12:00 am Post subject: |
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Excellent cartoon - I am glad that some see Barbara Bush as she really is.
The difficulty of "knowing the enemy" is that they are such strange characters. What is Blair ? He is an actor. He is so shallow that he merely has pride in his performance. If a real actor played Stalin and afterwards was accosted by someone saying "you tyrant - you have caused the deaths of millions, untold suffering ..." the actor would smile and say that he was pleased that they liked his convincing performance. Blair is a very good performer - brilliant. And as a British politician ? He is a traitor. A mix of Qvisling and Lord Haw-Haw.
But Dubya Bush ..... what is he ? Still the spoilt Frat Boy of the early 70's ? My guess (and it is only a guess) is that he doesn't care at all - it is just a game and if the American people were daft enough to give him power, then that's just fine.
Perhaps the correct response was Rep. Lynn Woolsey [D-Ca] introduction of the Iraq War Powers Repeal Act of 2006 in July. Of course it didn't get through - but it was the correct thing to do. Take Dubya's toys away.
When Hillary Rodent-Clinton is happy to meet with Avigdor Liebermann from Israel's Yisrael Beiteinu party then one has to wonder which is the lesser of two evils. (Liebermann is an old-style Fascist - actively promoting ethnic cleansing).
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Richard Haut has worked with the architectural profession for over 25 years and produces the weekly Richard Haut's Competitions, which has given architects details of many thousands of projects for which they can apply across Britain and Europe. |
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Ed Ziomek
Joined: 07 Jun 2005
Posts: 562
Location: Stamford, Connecticut
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| Posted: Sun Dec 10, 2006 3:36 pm Post subject: America defeating America? |
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Great responses, great cartoon...painfully true.
In the last 72 hours, I have heard the following news stories...
1. An American war-plane bombed a residential home I believe near Baghdad and killed 20 "insurgents". The Iraqi version is that those 20 were at least 16 women and children.
For the first time ever, let me ask the dumb question...what can America gain by using planes to bomb a single residential home?
Will bombing a home make the results of this Iraqi tragedy one ounce better, or can it only defeat America a million or 10 million times over? Let me add American tanks attacking homes, etc. etc., what can we gain by these tragedies?
2. I am seeing American troops still entering Iraqi homes, still pointing guns at Iraqi civilians, looking for insurgents, all on the 6 o'clock news.
What good does this use of our military troops do at this late date? Haven't three years of this methodology only seen an increase in the violence and anti-American sentiment? Doesn't this put more American troops in the position of danger and bad image?
3. A national radio host on Friday night opened his show with a catastrophic "charicature" spoof of a specific international religious leader, who was extolling children of that faith to receive "suicide kits" and other bomb making material for Christmas to "kill infidels".
Let me be the first to say that this clown should be allowed to stand on any soap box, in any American city, and spew whatever hate he can muster, and if he gets punched out, so be it. But to use a national radio show to mis-characterize this faith, in such a horrificly violent sense, is massively dangerous and WRONG! And I will notify that radio group and all his sponsors of my opinions.
I am not a smart person, I fear deeply that I may not be a sane person, but isn't America defeating America here, in the short term, and the middle term, and the long run? Have we learned NOTHING from nobody, EVER!!!?
Where is the outrage!??
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SDR
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Joined: 02 Oct 2004
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Location: San Francisco
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| Posted: Sun Dec 10, 2006 5:14 pm Post subject: |
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Americans are fat and happy, relatively speaking. They have numerous entertainments and distractions, and bombs aren't falling on their homes. Thus, no outrage about what their leaders and others are doing half a world away. But, Nov 7 brought the first signs of awakening. . .
SDR |
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