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Antisthenes
Joined: 28 Nov 2006
Posts: 648
Location: Phoenix
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 Posted: Fri Sep 28, 2007 3:51 pm Post subject: |
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GFRC ?
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mx2
millennium club
Joined: 18 Jan 2006
Posts: 1968
Location: Miami, Florida
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| Posted: Fri Sep 28, 2007 4:00 pm Post subject: |
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GFRC, aka Cast Stone...is great for Copings, Freizes, Balustrades, Column capitals & bases, you know...decorative pieces, but as a complete wall finish it's expensive and how do you maintain it? God forbid you decide to paint it...
mx2.5
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*Science of Architecture: The calculated use of technical skill and knowledge in the construction of a functional building. |
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Antisthenes
Joined: 28 Nov 2006
Posts: 648
Location: Phoenix
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| Posted: Fri Sep 28, 2007 4:11 pm Post subject: |
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not so
look at the STRATA system(GFRC skinned monolithic EPS) it looks great painted (Zero VOC please) it takes a plethora of coatings and can have many finishes itself. a smidgen of dry wall mud even...
it IS the structural of the wall system even, standing up to 400 mph plus hurricane winds earthquakes, fire, cracking you name it.
i still prefer a good Native American Indian adobe mud plaster myself
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mx2
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Joined: 18 Jan 2006
Posts: 1968
Location: Miami, Florida
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| Posted: Fri Sep 28, 2007 4:19 pm Post subject: |
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Adobe first, for sure...I'm restoring an old mansion now, but unfortunately not with real mud. Haha...ironic!
I'm not familiar with the STRATA system although I have heard of it. I suppose a skim coat (like a parge coat) over a synthetic rigid substrate would work perfectly and come in easy to manipulate units.
I thought you meant Cast Stone adhered directly to the structure and then would have to be painted for weatherproofing, at least, if one would want to do that...basically an opaque curtain wall, made of cast stone. Not unheard of...but I do beleive we've (*I) have gone off tangent. Ha!
mx2.5
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*Science of Architecture: The calculated use of technical skill and knowledge in the construction of a functional building. |
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mousebg
Joined: 26 Sep 2007
Posts: 7
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| Posted: Sat Sep 29, 2007 6:19 am Post subject: |
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Quote: So out of curiosity I went back to James Hardie and found this:
http://www.jameshardie.com.au/Products/ExternalCladding/PanelCladSheets/
[color=black]That is an Australian site. I wonder if that is even available in the US, as I didn't see that on the US site. What they have there is Hardipanel with a stucco look.[/size] The US website is just www.jameshardie.com. The specific site I found the "stucco" siding on is:
http://www.jameshardie.com/developer/products_siding_hardiepanelSiding.py
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mx2
millennium club
Joined: 18 Jan 2006
Posts: 1968
Location: Miami, Florida
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| Posted: Sun Sep 30, 2007 11:34 am Post subject: |
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I think it's a similar product, from what I can tell. I didn't notice the au extension...good call! The HardiePanel is the way to go, regardless...
if you choose to do "fake" stucco. The big question I have to you, based on what Chris mentioned, is what kind of construction are we talking about here? Concrete block? Wood sheathing? What region of the country are you building this? Why do you have hurricane concerns in mind? Are there not code requirements and other common practices to minimize the dangers of hurricanes already in effect in your area?
mx2.5
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*Art of Architecture: The conscious use of skill and creative imagination in the production of an aesthetic building.
*Science of Architecture: The calculated use of technical skill and knowledge in the construction of a functional building. |
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mousebg
Joined: 26 Sep 2007
Posts: 7
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| Posted: Sun Sep 30, 2007 1:53 pm Post subject: |
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| mx2 wrote: | I think it's a similar product, from what I can tell. I didn't notice the au extension...good call! The HardiePanel is the way to go, regardless...
if you choose to do "fake" stucco. The big question I have to you, based on what Chris mentioned, is what kind of construction are we talking about here? Concrete block? Wood sheathing? What region of the country are you building this? Why do you have hurricane concerns in mind? Are there not code requirements and other common practices to minimize the dangers of hurricanes already in effect in your area?
mx2.5 |
We will be building on the Texas Gulfcoast about 30 miles north of Corpus Christi - Rockport, TX. Our lot is on a Bay and separated from the Gulf of Mexico by a barrier island 8 miles out in the bay. We are from the Texas Hill Country north of San Antonio, so have no experience with hurricanes. We just like the look of stucco with palm trees - has a nice tropical look. There are many stucco houses there in pastel colors. I don't know what the building codes are, but I am sure they have them. That is why we have an architect.
The problem is we told the architect we want stucco and he went off on this soap box about how expensive stucco is and that we really don't want it and we should do hardisiding (horizontal) - which looks like wood siding. I don't want that, so I found the Hardipanel stuff that looks like stucco.
My husband wants to do traditional frame - 2x4s I guess. He doesn't want concrete block because it is ugly on the inside and would have to be drywalled as well as the traditional frame home. We thought the stucco would be better in a hurricane than siding. I told him your previous post said stucco would cost around $12,000 - $18,000 for 2000 sq. ft. house. He said he felt siding would cost about $12,000. My husband's concern with the Hardipanel is that it will have to have seams, because it only comes in 4x10 feet. The house we are building has 9ft. ceilings and several peaks, so that is where it would need to be seamed. He thought that might look awful.
I guess we will just have to get bids when the time comes, and hope the stucco is within reason.
You sure have raised some interesting points though and I have found this whole thread to be informative and interesting.
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mx2
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Joined: 18 Jan 2006
Posts: 1968
Location: Miami, Florida
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| Posted: Sun Sep 30, 2007 5:36 pm Post subject: |
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Well, I wish you both lots of luck and an ejoyable process...for what it is worth, having been througha few hurricanes, I would never opt for anything less than concrete block exterior walls (the interior walls can be anything), including concrete gables. The trusses are still wood, but the interior of a masonry wall is always finished with something, including plaster if need be...
You will have joints but a good architect will design the joint locations to make the wall look aesthetically pleasing.
My house (here in South Miami...about 4 miles from the coast) is concrete with stucco. But here's more food for thought...if a big one heads my way (knock on wood), I'm packing my car with my wife and kid and heading north...regardless of what my house is made of. That's what insurance is for,... 
mx2.5
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*Science of Architecture: The calculated use of technical skill and knowledge in the construction of a functional building. |
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mousebg
Joined: 26 Sep 2007
Posts: 7
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| Posted: Mon Oct 01, 2007 6:56 am Post subject: |
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| mx2 wrote: |
My house (here in South Miami...about 4 miles from the coast) is concrete with stucco. But here's more food for thought...if a big one heads my way (knock on wood), I'm packing my car with my wife and kid and heading north...regardless of what my house is made of. That's what insurance is for,...
mx2.5 |
I don't think we are nearly as exposed to a hurricanes full force as you are in Miami. Even though we are on the water, it is about 10 miles from the actual gulf. Having been visiting in Rockport during a storm (not a hurricane) I can assure you, I wouldn't stay for an actual hurricane.We definitely would head out as well [Northwest in our location]. I just would prefer having a house when we get back.
So you think concrete block is better than stucco. That is opening a new can or worms for us. How expensive is that? I would think much more than stucco. Maybe we should move to Chicago!  |
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mx2
millennium club
Joined: 18 Jan 2006
Posts: 1968
Location: Miami, Florida
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| Posted: Mon Oct 01, 2007 7:30 am Post subject: |
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Sorry, I'm not explaining it well enough: first, we must identify the structure (wood or concrete?), then we identify the finish (Siding? Hardipanel? Stucco?
In other words, you can have a wood structure (including plywood sheathing as your exterior walls) that you can apply any of the finishes listed above. And vice versa, you can apply any finish to any structure (stucco on wood structure or concrete block, or wood siding on both). Think of the Three Little Pigs...I huff and I puff...wood or concrete? That's what my personal take is on the subject of hurricane resistance, best to build with concrete structure and then talk about how to finish it.
mx2.5
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*Science of Architecture: The calculated use of technical skill and knowledge in the construction of a functional building. |
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Antisthenes
Joined: 28 Nov 2006
Posts: 648
Location: Phoenix
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| Posted: Mon Oct 01, 2007 2:07 pm Post subject: |
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| mx2 wrote: | Adobe first, for sure...I'm restoring an old mansion now, but unfortunately not with real mud. Haha...ironic!
I'm not familiar with the STRATA system although I have heard of it. I suppose a skim coat (like a parge coat) over a synthetic rigid substrate would work perfectly and come in easy to manipulate units.
I thought you meant Cast Stone adhered directly to the structure and then would have to be painted for weatherproofing, at least, if one would want to do that... |
EPS is water resistant, blown plastic beads mostly air. Better than tossing it into a dump, make it walls.
a mansion ? if it is wood framed i have never seen a adobe paster wood structure as the mud does best on top of mud(like particles attract)
www.strataus.com
this stuff stands up to huricanes and is super easy to build with
but if you are going with a block wall, i say look at the OmniBlock system unless dry stack is not allowed under your code?
as far as stucco on concrete block as the trends go now i say leave it unfinished and sandblast and seal it(non toxic sealer course).
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The most necessary/useful piece of learning is that which unlearns what is untrue: 'evil'
may be acquired, Happiness through virtue which is based on knowledge!/? |
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mx2
millennium club
Joined: 18 Jan 2006
Posts: 1968
Location: Miami, Florida
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| Posted: Mon Oct 01, 2007 2:25 pm Post subject: |
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FYI (off topic, sorry ) this mansion had walls built out of hollow clay blocks and finished with plaster on wood lath...the floor/roof strcuture was wood and burned down twice...now we're trying to restore it to its original shape, with a few modern amenities...
mx2.5
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*Science of Architecture: The calculated use of technical skill and knowledge in the construction of a functional building. |
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csintexas
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Joined: 06 Feb 2006
Posts: 1919
Location: USA
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| Posted: Mon Oct 01, 2007 7:37 pm Post subject: |
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You may want to look into ICF wall construction also mousebg
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Chris Stewart
Modern Texas Home Project |
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mousebg
Joined: 26 Sep 2007
Posts: 7
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| Posted: Tue Oct 02, 2007 5:58 am Post subject: |
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| csintexas wrote: | | You may want to look into ICF wall construction also mousebg |
Thanks, I will. But, what is that? Boy you sure can tell I don't know a lot about this building stuff. I did look up the strata and that looks pretty cool. I wonder how expensive it is vs. stucco?
There is a product here in Texas that comes in panels. They sort of snap together. They are also supposed to save 70% on heating/cooling and be better in hurricanes. I don't remember the name of it. They are building several around the place we have our lot. We asked our architect about it, and he thought that was a bunch of hooey. But, we are probably going to fire him anyway. He is trying to build a house that HE likes and is making changes to the floor plan we gave him. He also is arguing about the siding which is how I ended up writing to all of you.
But, I digres - back to the original question - what is ICF? 
mouse |
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csintexas
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Joined: 06 Feb 2006
Posts: 1919
Location: USA
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| Posted: Tue Oct 02, 2007 6:55 am Post subject: |
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You are probably talking about ICF (Insulating Concrete Forms) construction.
They are hollow foam blocks that are assembled and then have concrete pumped inside of them to form the walls. The exterior is usually stucco. This system will not save 70% over a typical well insulated wall in our area (maybe 20-30%) but they are quite a bit stronger than conventional walls. I am not sure about the performance of any one well built structure vs. another in high winds (the roof also needs to be attached well).
That happens a lot, I have done several jobs over the years where people have tried to work with an architect and not been happy, go find a residential designer or ask the builder who they use.
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Modern Texas Home Project |
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